Bruce Wayne: A portrait of the Batman as a young man

[winter]

I’ve been thinking – and yes, this is more Bat-meta, just because I missed everyone else’s due to the film not being out yet. Anyway.

It’s the perennial question of book vs movie canon. In this case, it’s a big characterization difference between the two, and in the main character at that.

Take ethics. This is a big one, and something that struck me: in the movie, Ra’s does succeed in breaking down Bruce’s resolve a bit. Bruce leaves him to die.

This is something comicbook-Batman would not do.

For me, that’s the charm and appeal of Batman: he’s the Dark Knight, and his chivalric code does not allow him to take life or let life be taken. Exactly this – not saving a villain – is where Jean-Paul Valley fails as Batman in the Knightfall trilogy. I’ve once read a fic where Bruce’s identity was revealed because the only way to save a villain about to fall was to take his cape off and hook the villain with the cowl. And it made sense, because that’s what Bruce is: that’s why he’s a Hero. It’s not the ninja skills, the cool gadgets or the detective skills: it’s being better than normal people.

The only reason I’m willing to forgive movie!Bruce is because it was Ra’s, and Ra’s /told/ Bruce he was immortal.

Another difference lies in trust. This is partly an issue of age: movie!Bruce, for all his adventures, hasn’t spent that much time guarding Gotham, and is more inclined to trust people. As Batman in the comics, more innocence is lost on each case. I have to factor in the fact that the Bat-comics are read were all after Dick was shot. After Barbara lost the use of her legs. After Jason. And in the most, after Knightfall as well. Take even what we know happens just after he puts on the mask – just after the movie, if you will. Harvey (Rachel), his ally, scarred and driven mad, and now his enemy. That, most of all, is what shows Batman people can’t be trusted fully, can’t be let in that close.

Apart from the trust issue, there’s a childlike innocence to movie!Bruce. He’s honestly enjoying designing the Bat-gadgets and walking around scaring people. I think it’s part of why he has to lose the Wayne Manor: this is not a game, not something he can walk away from unscathed. The fire and Rachel agree: he has to bury Bruce Wayne and become Batman.

The above is my attempt to justify the fact my muse-room has two racks of Bat costumes.

There are other interesting characterization differences. The shift of the Ra’s dynamic from the comicbook stern father-candidate to a mentor/friend who wants an equal at his side. How much of that difference is Talia, Talia, Talia, and who wants to bet that if I posted a movieverse Talia fic to the Batman Begins section, it’d end up on a Mary Sue community inside 24 hours?

And Crane: from a mocked literal scarecrow, overly tall and gangly, who develops his own fighting style in a graceful if delirious symmetry with his own poison, to model looks and twisted ambitions. Arguably this makes him even more evil, since he does not have the excuse of a put-upon childhood for his evil: sane is much worse than mad. I happen to think that it takes away from the character, and I like the way helens78 replaced it with sexual violence from his peers in her Sense of Fear stories.

Don’t get me started on Harvey/Rachel. Just don’t :P


In other news, a list I’m on has been discussing Myers-Briggs personality types. I’ve done the full test long ago, and I’m a picture-perfect ENTP. Q, Bugs Bunny, Garfield – take your pick. Go me.

Comments

[azarias.livejournal.com]

I'm not certain that I've ever actually met an ENTP in real life -- not for extended periods of time, at least. An NT brain with an extrovert's approach to life? That's worth an eek :-D

[winter]

That's why we're also called the Evil Geniuses and the devil's advocates :D That site I linked is eerily correct on all points of my personality, including considering people I don't care about as either audience or cannon fodder.

[azarias.livejournal.com]

Well, I can respect that. Fear it a little, but also respect it :)

I go back and forth on Myers-Briggs types. Half the time I think the test is pretty much useless, as it's basically summarizing what you tell it. The other half, I think "Damn, I'm an INTP -- not likely to think anything else of it, am I?". Though I've been told I come across as an INTJ; I just hide the P very well.

[neotoma.livejournal.com]

You probably have. Know any engineers? Especially ones who will solve problems while bouncing up and down and babbling about how they are solving the problem?

They are pretty unmistakeable.

[kiraboshi.livejournal.com]

who wants to bet that if I posted a movieverse Talia fic to the Batman Begins section, it’d end up on a Mary Sue community inside 24 hours?

I think that's the problem with a lot of fic writers in general -- they only look at the film and believe everything else to be made up. Before this film, I hadn't really read any of the comics, but when I decided to write a fic, I did a TON of research on the comics and read a few just to know what I was messing with (that's how I know who Talia is!).

Perhaps that's why I enjoy your fic so much -- you pull in things from the comics and expand past the film -- yet still use it as a starting off point. I've been reading and writing fic for a long time, and it never fails to amaze me how many writers just don't do the research, don't care about what they're messing with, and seem to think they know everything.

Sorry for the long rant. ;) I just get so grrrr at people who don't take the time to learn a little something before writing.

[winter]

Oooh yes. Tolkien's one of my fandoms, you don't need to tell me about it >_< That's a whole fanficrants in itself.

It's especially jarring with something that's as rooted in popculture as Batman. I have no issues with people taking the movie on its own and taking it from there, but not if they're subverting the very spirit of the story. There's canon and then there's canon - next thing you know, we'll be reading things with Bruce as a gourmet chef for godssakes ;)

[kiraboshi.livejournal.com]

Ouch. Yeah, I can understand that one. I stayed away from online Tolkien fandom for that reason.

C'mon, don't you think he'd be a good chef? *laughs*

I keep trying to find you online -- you must think I'm a crazy stalker by now or something. Drop me a message sometime when you're online -- chatting in comments is fun and all, but I don't want to bog down your journal.

[imadra-blue.livejournal.com]

Nice observations. I'm not so much into the Bat-comics because there is so much there and I'd spend my life (and a small fortune) trying to catch up. Movie!Bruce is fresh, and so is the continuity. There's room to grow, to exposition, to have fun with introducing other elements. One reason I prefer to write X-Men movieverse and Batman movieverse over the comicverses.

But... was Rachel actually a female version of Two-Face's character? I hadn't noticed that. @_@

I need to the Batman Begins movie again, I have a feeling I'm forgetting things.

[winter]

Quite frankly, movie!Bruce is much more fun for me to write, precisely because he has fewer issues. He can talk to children who want to be vigilantes without thinking of Jason, he can enlist allies without thinking of how they'll be taken away from him, and he can have fun just being Batman - something comics Batsy has long forgotten how to do. I never wrote comics!Bats, simply because he's far too iconic for me. There's not much fun writing him when you know he'll win, he has to. He's Batman; movie!Bruce is still learning that.

As for Rachel, she fills Harvey's role: the idealistic but bogged down by corruption (assistant) district attorney who's Batman's counterpart - the Bat brings people to justice, the DA puts them behind bars. In both cases they're Bruce/Batman's friends, in both cases I didn't get much more of the original personality than that. Oh, and a tendency to think in black and white, though that's just an impression I got.

[fyrie.livejournal.com]

You know, you are one of the few people I know who will openly admit to having a muse-room :D This makes me happy and feel less solitary in the muse-infested madness :)

[winter]

You've never been in the Tolkien fandom, have you? Elves-In-The-Head Theatre will make anyone feel sane :D

I don't even have that many externalized muses. Corwin of Amber, Sheldon Sands and Dooku are it. Everyone else thankfully stays put in the muse room until I want them.

[fyrie.livejournal.com]

*grins* I'm well into Tolkien-verse. I have mainly Third age central Elves (ie. Thranduil, Legolas, Celebrian, Arwen, Glorfindel and Rumil) but I did pick up a Maglor somewhere along the way :)

Not to mention men of Gondor. Somehow I picked up Denethor, Boromir and Faramir...

[winter]

Let's just say that tehta's and maelipstick's muses usually make me and mine feel sane, even the eyeless psychobeauty CIA agent. Though with Sparky Feanor, sanity's debatable.

And here's the third batch:

http://s58.yousendit.com/d.php?id=16CDBQ872NC0O15INC2AEFYCGO

Let me know when you finish downloading these, I might as well throw them on the blog in friendslocked format to use up the rest of the downloads...

[fyrie.livejournal.com]

Regarding muses, my boys were dragged through time to modern day, thanks to wanting to continue to be used in RPGs involving every fandom and their mother. I've had one who has gone insane and come back again, because he didn't like the view, I've got one who is an insanely powerful empath and gets all kind of crazy when bad things are happening, then we have my Maeglor. Good Lord, is he messed up. In present-day terms, he's undeniably and contentedly atheist, but also a human-hater and drug- and alcohol-addicted person. He's sick of humans, but can't even get into the West if he tried. *pets him* He likes his drugs. They make his brain go blank for a while.


Re. Sandman - I just tried to start downloading the first, but my connection didn't even get up to 5% before I got disconnected. I'm on extremely, extremely crummy dialup, so it looks like I may have to invade the computer-zone in the library, download and CD-ify, which won't be until the middle of this week :-S

I keep saying to the parents that we need broadband, that it would be so much cheaper, but do they listen? Heck no.